Post by darkstar2 on Jan 27, 2009 3:27:21 GMT
Tom DiCillo, WHEN YOU’RE STRANGE Interview, Sundance 2009
Tom DiCillo has been a Sundance mainstay for years, having had over five films in the festival since 1992. Some of the standouts include 1995’s Living in Oblivion (a must-see for any aspiring filmmaker) to 2007’s Delirious, both of which star Steve Buscemi. This year he’s back with a documentary about The Doors, When You’re Strange. It’s a feature-length movie comprised entirely of never-before-seen archival film footage, consisting of rehearsals, concerts, vintage television appearances, and it also includes most of Highway, a student film Morrison made and stars in. While the documentary doesn’t offer us anything new about the band, it’s a unique look at one of the most famous American bands to emerge from the 1960s.
So, when did you first get approached about this? Did they approach you, or was this your idea?
They approached me. It came through a very strange channel… I never would have expected it. A friend of mine is an actor, and he was on Law & Order. Do you know Chris Noth?
Yes.
We’ve been acting together.
You also did a film with him.
Yes, I did. At one point, he said, “Listen, why don’t you come and direct one of these Law and Orders“? And he pressured me a little bit, so I did it. It turned out well. They were pleased that I brought an acting sensibility. So the actors loved me, and I went back and I did another one, and I did two more. The producers liked it.
Next thing I know, Dick Wolf calls me. He says, we have all this footage; do you want to direct this documentary of the tour? That’s how it happened.
Of course I said yes immediately, not even knowing what the project was. I just said, “What a great opportunity.” Then I saw that my material was really going to be all of this archival footage, real footage. I don’t like that word, archival. It makes it sound musty, like it’s covered in dust. This footage looks brand new.
I said, “Wow, let me try to…” What would make me want to make this like a personal film would be if I could use this footage and just use it. Don’t have people blabbing away, just use the footage to tell the story.
When you say, “they” had this footage, do you mean Dick Wolf had the rights to it?
Yes. They made a deal with the Doors, they said we will give you access to this material; they’ve had it for forty years. No one had been able to put it in a form. They didn’t know how to. They kept asking me, what’s your concept? That was hard to come up with something. It ended up stumbling upon a film that Morrison made called Highway. Do you know about this one?
Yes, John Densmore was mentioning that earlier. I haven’t seen it, but he said most people haven’t.
It’s just all this incredible 35mm footage of Morrison wandering through the desert. He’s got a beard, he looks incredible. It gave me this idea of making the film much more dramatic like a narrative feature, by using this character as Jim Morrison, wandering through the film. That was exciting.
So, how many hours? Did you actually watch everything?
Pretty much. I didn’t see every one of their TV performances and stuff like that, but pretty much I looked at every inch of this footage. I looked at it for three weeks, about eight to nine hours a day.
That sounds like a full time job, just watching the footage
Yes, the producers were behind me the whole time saying, “Do you have your concept yet?”
Was this footage shot by somebody they had hired that day, and said “Shoot this for us”?
Yes, a friend of theirs. Morrison went to film school - he met Ray Manzarek at UCLA - a couple of their friends, one of them was this guy named Paul Ferraro, and he followed the Doors around for about five years and shot all this film.
Wow. Is he still around?
Yes, he is.
Was he involved in this at all?
No. I asked him a few questions. He confirmed my suspicions. My instinct that Morrison was infinitely much more complex than just this raging drunk, that he was a human being, a boy at times. I appreciated getting that look.
That makes me wonder, what did you think about the Oliver Stone film about The Doors?
It’s hard to answer that question without sounding judgmental. I don’t want to sound that way. I looked at the first three minutes and I had to turn it off. I just found it utterly phony. Now, a lot of people didn’t. John Densmore likes it.
Yes, he said that.
He likes it. So, you know, I just found it phony. I didn’t believe it. Then when I saw this real footage, I realized what was phony. It was that it was one-dimensional. It was completely one dimensional. No human being is one dimensional. No story is one dimensional. I was bored by it.
Speaking of one dimensional, was it a struggle to pull out other Doors’ stories in this footage?
A little bit. Listen, Morrison’s character is the most dynamic. He went through the biggest changes and so he leads the story. But, the rest of the guys had very specific and just fascinating relationships. Robby Krieger was a tremendously gifted songwriter. I didn’t know that he wrote half the songs. He did, he wrote “Light My Fire.” Jim took him under his wing. He encouraged him as a songwriter, that’s amazing.
I mentioned that in the film, that each of them had a very specific musical function, as well as this function of supporting Morrison so that he could go crazy and always have someplace to come back to.
Right.
I came to respect all of them.
I was reading on your blog about the whole process with Delirious, back and forth with gestation and everything. It seemed like the most painful… did you blog during the production of this film as well?
A little bit. I couldn’t as much, because I was so intensely involved. The pressure was enormous. I was hired to do this in January of last year. The concept kind of came together at the beginning of February. They were thinking they were going to take it to Cannes last year. I said, “Guys, four months, you guys are crazy.” And I was right. We literally just finished the final print two weeks ago.
So, it’s been a long experience. But, it could have been longer. I mean, it was a tremendous amount to assimilate and to try to organize. The organization was the biggest challenge. I was just too… so what I was saying was that I would go into the editing room all day, come home, [snoring sound], or sit down and write another two pages of narration so we could then have something to do the next day. So I had my stuff to do.
Are you already thinking about your next film? Have you started working on anything?
I’m getting close to it. I mean, this has been… this is a whole effort in itself.
Which is strange for you, too, because you’ve never done a documentary.
No, I haven’t. I know.
And especially a documentary that you’re not shooting.
Right.
You’re putting it together, basically.
But, it’s not a straight documentary. That’s what I like about it. I think people will still see that it has elements of my sensibility.
So, are you going to go back to narrative after this, or would you ever make another documentary?
Yes, of course I would. I would never say no to anything that excited me. That’s my… I never once thought of that, like, “Oh, wow, it’s a documentary, I shouldn’t do it.” I knew I didn’t want to make just a traditional documentary with people talking about the Doors.
And I knew that - quite honestly, I’m going to be totally straight with you - the idea of being the first person to tell this story was really a turn-on. I said, “Yeah, I’ll do that.” Because I think these guys are just - they were an amazing band. Still today, you feel people respond to them and what they stood for.
What was your first Doors experience? You remember the first time you heard their music?
Yes, I do. You want to hear it?
Sure, of course.
Actually, I wrote this in the blog, so maybe…
*laughs* I could just copy it off the blog?
Well, no. You can, but… I’ll just tell you. I was 14. I was on my way to a junior high school dance. I had just emptied a Liquid Prell bottle of shampoo and filled it with my father’s Scotch. I was in a car, and the instrumental version of “Light My Fire” came on. To this day, that whole mind-blowing experience of hearing a song that wasn’t two minutes long - it just kept going and going, and I was like, “This is on the radio?” - this is connected to sips of Scotch that were laced with soap.
So, that was my first experience. And just the idea that they had broken the form, the whole two-minute song form. And it was just interesting music, you know, it was adult music. But, interesting that the music, even still, it’s so fascinating… you look at some of this footage of their concerts, there’s kids like seven or eight years old. Ten years old. At these… [laughs]
Rocking out at these Doors concerts.
As well as adults. I mean, the only other band that did something like that is… are these stupid teenybopper bands. I guess, people never really took the time to go to a concert, but they let their kids go. But, it appealed to the kids, and they got something out of it.
Did you send this film to them at various stages for notes, the other members of the band?
We’d have screenings. I went out to Los Angeles to do it, and so they would come in individually and screen it and give suggestions… I had to be careful that I didn’t let them steer it into a version of history that was more comfortable. I felt like the thing that made this band great was that they just… they went out there. And I said that at times, the movie has to go out there.
Have you found the blog to be a pretty good release for you? I mean, it was really cool to see you going back and forth with people that would comment. A lot of people just write and then they just ignore the comments. Have you found that to be a good outlet for you?
Yes, I do. Because it’s there, you know? It’s an interesting public forum. I take it seriously. I feel that if people write me an anonymous question or an anonymous statement, I’d love to respond to it. It touches me. And I also try to give people information that I think will appeal to them, will interest them. I think it’s a great - you know, of course everybody and their brother has a blog [laughs], so…
A lot of people are brutally honest, and you tended to be, I noticed, on there, it was like…most people give the safe PR answer, and you were like, “Here’s what happened, and fuck these guys, and etc etc.”
I wish I could be more honest, in some instances, but I’m glad you’re reading.
blog.spout.com/2009/01/20/tom-dicillo-when-youre-strange-interview-sundance-2009/
Tom DiCillo has been a Sundance mainstay for years, having had over five films in the festival since 1992. Some of the standouts include 1995’s Living in Oblivion (a must-see for any aspiring filmmaker) to 2007’s Delirious, both of which star Steve Buscemi. This year he’s back with a documentary about The Doors, When You’re Strange. It’s a feature-length movie comprised entirely of never-before-seen archival film footage, consisting of rehearsals, concerts, vintage television appearances, and it also includes most of Highway, a student film Morrison made and stars in. While the documentary doesn’t offer us anything new about the band, it’s a unique look at one of the most famous American bands to emerge from the 1960s.
So, when did you first get approached about this? Did they approach you, or was this your idea?
They approached me. It came through a very strange channel… I never would have expected it. A friend of mine is an actor, and he was on Law & Order. Do you know Chris Noth?
Yes.
We’ve been acting together.
You also did a film with him.
Yes, I did. At one point, he said, “Listen, why don’t you come and direct one of these Law and Orders“? And he pressured me a little bit, so I did it. It turned out well. They were pleased that I brought an acting sensibility. So the actors loved me, and I went back and I did another one, and I did two more. The producers liked it.
Next thing I know, Dick Wolf calls me. He says, we have all this footage; do you want to direct this documentary of the tour? That’s how it happened.
Of course I said yes immediately, not even knowing what the project was. I just said, “What a great opportunity.” Then I saw that my material was really going to be all of this archival footage, real footage. I don’t like that word, archival. It makes it sound musty, like it’s covered in dust. This footage looks brand new.
I said, “Wow, let me try to…” What would make me want to make this like a personal film would be if I could use this footage and just use it. Don’t have people blabbing away, just use the footage to tell the story.
When you say, “they” had this footage, do you mean Dick Wolf had the rights to it?
Yes. They made a deal with the Doors, they said we will give you access to this material; they’ve had it for forty years. No one had been able to put it in a form. They didn’t know how to. They kept asking me, what’s your concept? That was hard to come up with something. It ended up stumbling upon a film that Morrison made called Highway. Do you know about this one?
Yes, John Densmore was mentioning that earlier. I haven’t seen it, but he said most people haven’t.
It’s just all this incredible 35mm footage of Morrison wandering through the desert. He’s got a beard, he looks incredible. It gave me this idea of making the film much more dramatic like a narrative feature, by using this character as Jim Morrison, wandering through the film. That was exciting.
So, how many hours? Did you actually watch everything?
Pretty much. I didn’t see every one of their TV performances and stuff like that, but pretty much I looked at every inch of this footage. I looked at it for three weeks, about eight to nine hours a day.
That sounds like a full time job, just watching the footage
Yes, the producers were behind me the whole time saying, “Do you have your concept yet?”
Was this footage shot by somebody they had hired that day, and said “Shoot this for us”?
Yes, a friend of theirs. Morrison went to film school - he met Ray Manzarek at UCLA - a couple of their friends, one of them was this guy named Paul Ferraro, and he followed the Doors around for about five years and shot all this film.
Wow. Is he still around?
Yes, he is.
Was he involved in this at all?
No. I asked him a few questions. He confirmed my suspicions. My instinct that Morrison was infinitely much more complex than just this raging drunk, that he was a human being, a boy at times. I appreciated getting that look.
That makes me wonder, what did you think about the Oliver Stone film about The Doors?
It’s hard to answer that question without sounding judgmental. I don’t want to sound that way. I looked at the first three minutes and I had to turn it off. I just found it utterly phony. Now, a lot of people didn’t. John Densmore likes it.
Yes, he said that.
He likes it. So, you know, I just found it phony. I didn’t believe it. Then when I saw this real footage, I realized what was phony. It was that it was one-dimensional. It was completely one dimensional. No human being is one dimensional. No story is one dimensional. I was bored by it.
Speaking of one dimensional, was it a struggle to pull out other Doors’ stories in this footage?
A little bit. Listen, Morrison’s character is the most dynamic. He went through the biggest changes and so he leads the story. But, the rest of the guys had very specific and just fascinating relationships. Robby Krieger was a tremendously gifted songwriter. I didn’t know that he wrote half the songs. He did, he wrote “Light My Fire.” Jim took him under his wing. He encouraged him as a songwriter, that’s amazing.
I mentioned that in the film, that each of them had a very specific musical function, as well as this function of supporting Morrison so that he could go crazy and always have someplace to come back to.
Right.
I came to respect all of them.
I was reading on your blog about the whole process with Delirious, back and forth with gestation and everything. It seemed like the most painful… did you blog during the production of this film as well?
A little bit. I couldn’t as much, because I was so intensely involved. The pressure was enormous. I was hired to do this in January of last year. The concept kind of came together at the beginning of February. They were thinking they were going to take it to Cannes last year. I said, “Guys, four months, you guys are crazy.” And I was right. We literally just finished the final print two weeks ago.
So, it’s been a long experience. But, it could have been longer. I mean, it was a tremendous amount to assimilate and to try to organize. The organization was the biggest challenge. I was just too… so what I was saying was that I would go into the editing room all day, come home, [snoring sound], or sit down and write another two pages of narration so we could then have something to do the next day. So I had my stuff to do.
Are you already thinking about your next film? Have you started working on anything?
I’m getting close to it. I mean, this has been… this is a whole effort in itself.
Which is strange for you, too, because you’ve never done a documentary.
No, I haven’t. I know.
And especially a documentary that you’re not shooting.
Right.
You’re putting it together, basically.
But, it’s not a straight documentary. That’s what I like about it. I think people will still see that it has elements of my sensibility.
So, are you going to go back to narrative after this, or would you ever make another documentary?
Yes, of course I would. I would never say no to anything that excited me. That’s my… I never once thought of that, like, “Oh, wow, it’s a documentary, I shouldn’t do it.” I knew I didn’t want to make just a traditional documentary with people talking about the Doors.
And I knew that - quite honestly, I’m going to be totally straight with you - the idea of being the first person to tell this story was really a turn-on. I said, “Yeah, I’ll do that.” Because I think these guys are just - they were an amazing band. Still today, you feel people respond to them and what they stood for.
What was your first Doors experience? You remember the first time you heard their music?
Yes, I do. You want to hear it?
Sure, of course.
Actually, I wrote this in the blog, so maybe…
*laughs* I could just copy it off the blog?
Well, no. You can, but… I’ll just tell you. I was 14. I was on my way to a junior high school dance. I had just emptied a Liquid Prell bottle of shampoo and filled it with my father’s Scotch. I was in a car, and the instrumental version of “Light My Fire” came on. To this day, that whole mind-blowing experience of hearing a song that wasn’t two minutes long - it just kept going and going, and I was like, “This is on the radio?” - this is connected to sips of Scotch that were laced with soap.
So, that was my first experience. And just the idea that they had broken the form, the whole two-minute song form. And it was just interesting music, you know, it was adult music. But, interesting that the music, even still, it’s so fascinating… you look at some of this footage of their concerts, there’s kids like seven or eight years old. Ten years old. At these… [laughs]
Rocking out at these Doors concerts.
As well as adults. I mean, the only other band that did something like that is… are these stupid teenybopper bands. I guess, people never really took the time to go to a concert, but they let their kids go. But, it appealed to the kids, and they got something out of it.
Did you send this film to them at various stages for notes, the other members of the band?
We’d have screenings. I went out to Los Angeles to do it, and so they would come in individually and screen it and give suggestions… I had to be careful that I didn’t let them steer it into a version of history that was more comfortable. I felt like the thing that made this band great was that they just… they went out there. And I said that at times, the movie has to go out there.
Have you found the blog to be a pretty good release for you? I mean, it was really cool to see you going back and forth with people that would comment. A lot of people just write and then they just ignore the comments. Have you found that to be a good outlet for you?
Yes, I do. Because it’s there, you know? It’s an interesting public forum. I take it seriously. I feel that if people write me an anonymous question or an anonymous statement, I’d love to respond to it. It touches me. And I also try to give people information that I think will appeal to them, will interest them. I think it’s a great - you know, of course everybody and their brother has a blog [laughs], so…
A lot of people are brutally honest, and you tended to be, I noticed, on there, it was like…most people give the safe PR answer, and you were like, “Here’s what happened, and fuck these guys, and etc etc.”
I wish I could be more honest, in some instances, but I’m glad you’re reading.
blog.spout.com/2009/01/20/tom-dicillo-when-youre-strange-interview-sundance-2009/