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Post by casandra on Mar 12, 2011 13:06:52 GMT
There are wickedness degrees, so the winner (gold medal) is Manzarek.
In the last decade, John Densmore seems to have lost the fear to be against Manzarek, which says a lot about him. He hasn’t lost all his moral integrity.
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Post by darkstar3 on Mar 12, 2011 14:56:37 GMT
Jim Morrison's grave around 1973. This photograph comes from Hervé Muller’s book “Jim Morrison and the Doors”, 1975 (Spanish edition). Thank you for posting this photo Cassandra. Herve Mullers' book sounds interesting as it was written in 1973 so the details of his relationship with Jim Morrison were fresh in his mind. Books written by people who knew Jim that have been published decades after his death, each hold a bit of truth for the individual who wrote it but, there is no way a person can remember minute by minute details about events that happened in their lives 30 or 40+ years ago. I remember what Roman Polanski said in interviews shortly after "The Pianist" film was released and I have never forgotten this quote: Roman Polanski (Oscar Winning Filmmaker): "Szpilman's book isn't just another chapter in the book of martyrdom we all know. In his memoirs, he describes these events from the point of view of a man who experienced them. The book was written shortly after the war (1946) and maybe this is why it is so fresh, unlike the accounts written later, 20–30 years after the war." The Jim Morrison myth has overshadowed the truth for many, many years. Facts have become so diluted and in this way new Doors fans are spoon fed these so called facts and ultimately come to believe them. I do hope more fans look into finding the truth for themselves as the facts are out there if a person choses to look for them. |
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Post by casandra on Mar 14, 2011 18:45:18 GMT
Thanks, Darkstar. The problem with all the books is the same; the witnesses only seem recall the most outrageous of Jim's personality. For example, Hervé Muller talks all details about his meeting with Jim when he was drunk (when Jim and Gilles Yepremian arrived at Muller’s apartment at 4 a.m., the lunch at the bar Alexandre the next day and the back to the apartment that afternoon when Jim was drunk again). Muller says he was shocked for Jim’s erratic behavior. However, when they met the next day and other times he met Jim (he was sober) Muller only writes few paragraphs saying he was polite, friendly and charming and they spoke about poetry, films and anything else. I think, this is the real injustice about Jim Morrison. It is difficult, even for his friends, remembering the intelligent man. Probably because he was often too shy or was alone. The biographers write many pages about his outrageous personality and they write a few paragraphs about the other aspects. For me, as I said some days ago, these other aspects are more important for knowledge of the man but we know very little about these. These are hidden behind the myth. We can think and imagine, but no more. As you posted on JD Forum: Joni Mitchell: I knew Jim Morrison a little bit. I liked him, but he was really shy and he drank too much. He'd be real quiet and pass out in his soup. I played on the same bill with Morrison, but I never went to see him.forum.johndensmore.com/index.php?showtopic=2463&pid=27643&mode=threaded&start=#entry27643Another opinion of an interview to former lead guitarist in 60s hitmakers, The Grass Roots, Creed Bratton Q: You knew Jim Morrison?
CB: Sure. He was drunk most of the time but when he wasn’t he was a very intelligent man.www.goldminemag.com/features/actormusician-creed-bratton-bounces-backI’m sure there are a lot of opinions like these about Jim Morrison, but they are almost unknown. However, opinions like this, they get more headlines in the newspapers. Lou Reed said this when he was interviewed in Spain in 2008: (Excerpt): Q: It is unfortunate that in these "complete works" you include a few little prose. I'm thinking that you perceptive text of 1970 where you reflected on Jimi Hendrix, Brian Epstein, Brian Jones and Janis Joplin deaths.
LR: Did you like it? At that time I needed money. I worked with my father [an accountant] and he was not very generous. During a moment of weakness I nurtured the idea of becoming a professional journalist. I would not have held it. I remember that I was commissioned to write a praise of Jim Morrison [The Doors singer died in 1971]. Here we come! So far!, I thought.
Q: Did not you like The Doors?
LR: They were rubbish of Los Angeles, pretentious garbage. And Morrison, an asshole.
Q: Do not you think that, like you with The Velvet Underground, Morrison broke schemes which could be sung in rock?
LR: He was just recycling the blues lyrics. He believed he was a sexual god, but he would not have survived a night at the Factory.www.elpais.com/articulo/portada/personaje/convirtio/algo/grotesco/elpepusoceps/20081109elpepspor_6/TesAfter this, on some blogs in Spain the people wrote a lot saying: “The real asshole and idiot is Lou Reed”.  |
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Post by TheWallsScreamedPoetry on Mar 14, 2011 19:26:07 GMT
This is one of the saddest things about the last 30 years. Once NOHGOA came out people realised that crazy Jim was a way to gain attention and make money. Of course the guy had a lot about him that was not great but it was not ALL there was to the guy. We have spent so long examining his bad side that his good side has been forgotten. The Doors are always talking Jimbo up and Jim down. I made several threads on the Densmore forum about this over the last few years and made the point that for once how nice it would be to see a more positive approach to Jim Morrison. If it was all bad then how did the band ever function. We have examined a bit on the threads here that point to not all the blame for the bad stuff being laid at the door of the dead singer. It's easy for the three survivors to put all that blame on Jim Morrison as he did have a bad side and being dead cannot argue with anything they say. It won't be long now before the shit starts to appear. John, Robby and Ray are bound to milk this anniversary for all it's worth and we know Ray simply regurgitates the garbage he has spouted since the 70s. John and Robby could do something different but I don't expect anything other than lots of mentions of Jimbo, rashes and drunkeness. The Doors had a chance with that stupid DiCillo film but could not get past the same old crap. A chance lost to tell a different story lost. There is a lot left to talk about with The Doors but it is not as sensational as the story that we have heard since the mid 70s. Drunk Jim sells. Sadly the ex Doors cannot get past that and 2011 will be no different to the 2008 sell fest. Sad!  |
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Post by TheWallsScreamedPoetry on Apr 4, 2011 8:30:57 GMT
Palm Beach Post
May 12 1974
CLOSED DOORS: The three surviving members of the Doors instituted a $250,000 lawsuit against Jim Morrison’s widow, Pamela, executrix of her late husband’s estate, shortly before Pamela was discovered dead in her Los Angeles apartment, victim of an apparent drug overdose. Morrison died of a heart attack in Paris in 1971.
And these guys were Jim's friends?
I think not.
Makes me sick hearing all these worthless platitudes about how much they miss Jim and how much he was their friend.
They did not give a crap about him in 1971 as he had left them in the lurch without their goose that laid golden eggs.
Also in 1971 they slapped a pair of handcuffs on him with a contract amendment that prevented him swiping The Doors name because they did not trust him.
In 1972 they snubbed him when 20 minutes walk from his grave and before his body cooled they were suing him for money that they perceived he owed them.
They only began shedding their crocodile tears when they realised how much he was worth to them.
He has been a 40 year meal ticket for this lot and that's why they have not done anything creative for decades.
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Post by TheWallsScreamedPoetry on Apr 6, 2011 16:01:43 GMT
Lizard King
The essential Jim Morrison
Page #184
In December 1971, the three surviving Doors filed papers of their own the court, making claims against the Morrison estate, most of it for a loan they said Jim had taken to help pay some of his legal costs.
Although the sum asked, less than $36,000, was small, considering the size of the estate, it was sufficient to bottle things up in court for two years.
Then in April 1974, the Doors came back with another lawsuit, now requesting repayment of a $250,000 loan allegedly made by the Doors Corporation to Jim as an advance against his share of future royalities.
At the same time, Max Fink, who continued to represent the Doors, submitted a bill for approximately $75,000 for work done on the Phoenix and Miami trials. Next the Miami law firm filed suit for unpaid services.
Eventually, a compromise ws reached. Pam relented, agreeing to pay everyone, Max Fink said he authorized a loan to Pam in the interim.
Much of which was spent on a mink coat and a yellow VW Beetle. Then as the final accounting of the estate was being made, Pam died.
If she had lived, she would have received about $500,000 right away, plus a quarter of everything the Doors who make in the future, a sum that subsequently proved to be worth millions.
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gizmo
Door Half Open
Posts: 113
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Post by gizmo on Apr 8, 2011 14:07:05 GMT
strange that jim´s money he had loaned had to be paid back while the royalties of the music doesn´t get paid, or is it still payed to the courson/morisson families?
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Post by TheWallsScreamedPoetry on Apr 8, 2011 14:46:39 GMT
Paid to the Courson/Morrison family  |
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Post by kristyob on Apr 11, 2011 8:44:27 GMT
And originally it wasn't even going to go to the Morrisons. Didn't they have to take the Coursons to court (or threaten it) to get half of their share ?
All of these people are lawsuit enthusiasts.
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Post by TheWallsScreamedPoetry on Apr 11, 2011 9:01:16 GMT
Indeed that's true Kristy, the Morrison clan had to go to court to get their own 12% share of Jim as Pam's death left it all with her lot.
Lot of money to be made from ole Jim's bones.
Makes a mockery of some of the drivel Ray comes out with as when it is all said and done the 'money' always seems the most important aspect. Which is obviously the supreme irony as this was the part Jim had least interest in.
The 'art' of the Doors took a back seat decades ago in favour of the 'brand'. The imbecile manager Jeff Jampol may have been one of the first to use brand as a description of The Doors but the thought was there long before this liar came onto the scene.
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Post by darkstar3 on Apr 11, 2011 14:00:54 GMT
Pamela asked Max Fink to draw up a will for her and he refused. Instead of seeking another attorney to prepare a will, Pamela died without one. This left the estate open for several parties to take control. We know the State of California took their share off the top in taxes, there were also known claims totaling over $250,000 that the surviving Doors had against the estate that according to news reports were paid when Pamela got tired of fighting with them. That leaves undisclosed amount in the Estate after all payments had been made. Because Jim left everything in his will to Pamela, her parents figured what was left now belonged to them and this fact certainly wasn't hidden.
Considering it was the Morrison's son Jim who's made the money it would seem logical on their part that they, like the Coursons felt they deserved half of the estate and any future royalties. Each of the families got 12.5% and one vote. In reality they each got 1/2 of a vote which unless they agreed on whatever they were voting on would cancel the other out.
Of course this is all speculation on my part because I do not have a copy of them court records in front of me. There is a copy of the families agreement on this forum for reference which includes limited information.
What would have happened if the Coursons and Morrison's did not got to court in order to gain receivership of the Estate? Think, now who is the one person in the surviving Doors who would have gladly taken the opportunity to vote on Jim's behalf?
If this person or person(s) gained the right to vote in Jim's stead how much would it have effected the Doors as a band?
The money left in the Estate at the time of Pamela's death, after the claims had been paid would have probably been divided among the families but think about the consequences of where Jim's vote and future royalties may have gone and most importantly who would have benefited the most by receiving ownership of them.
Begs the question: Who would you rather have controlling Jim's 25% share: A family member or the surviving Doors?
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Post by TheWallsScreamedPoetry on Apr 11, 2011 14:13:24 GMT
Begs the question: Who would you rather have controlling Jim's 25% share: A family member or the surviving Doors? I would rather have The Muppets or even Attila The Hun looking after Jim's 25% than that crew of opportunist back stabbers  Ray tried his best with his counter suit in the Densmore/Dork dispute to get an advantage by lying in court and claiming the veto power had never existed. Thankfully his arce was well and truly kicked. We can only guess at the pressure poor Pamela came under when she was alive and staving off their greedy plans to sell stuff. She does not get a lot of credit from Doors fans but she showed she understood Morrison better than that treacherous trio who saw an opportunity when Jim died and tried again to flog Light My Fire. Well done Pammy!  ;D |
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Post by darkstar3 on Apr 11, 2011 14:25:09 GMT
St Joseph News Press
April 27 1974
LOS ANGELES (AP) – Pamela Morrison, 27 year old widow of rock star Jim Morrison, has been found dead of an apparent drug overdose, police said Friday.
Morrison, the flamboyant star of the rock group “The Doors,” died in Paris in 1971 of an apparent heart attack while taking a bath.
Police said Mrs. Morrison was found dead in her bed late Thursday night by a friend, Johnny Mandell.
A hypodermic kit was found in her apartment, police said, Investigators said Mrs. Morrison has been receiving $1,500 a month pending settlement of her husband’s estate. He is buried in a small Paris cemetery which has become a shrine for many of his fans.
Mrs. Morrison, whose maiden name was Pamela Susan Courson, was described by friends as “an exquisite, intelligent girl.” She met Morrison when both were students at UCLA.
She heard him perfom at a small club and “they stayed together after that,” a friend said.
Her death occurred at the same age as Morrison’s.
At one point, Mrs. Morrison ran a clothing store in Los Angeles’ trendy La Cienga Blvd., designing dresses herself. But she eventually devoted all of her time to her husband’s career, traveling with him throughout the world.
Since his death, she had devoted much of her time to editing poetry and songs he had left behind. The settlement of his estate was complicated, and a business associate said she became troubled about the future use of his work.
“I hope Pamela is remembered as an incredibly intelligent person who had the thankless task of carrying on Jim’s work,” said Danny Sugerman, a long time friend. “She was not a drug addict, I know that,” said Sugerman. “If it’s true that she took heroin, then things just got to such a point in her life that she probably, would take anything.”
Another friend said:
“It was very rough. Her life with Jim was so total. She always tried to be cheerful…she kept trying. But it never went away. Jim was still there.”
END.
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Post by kristyob on Apr 11, 2011 17:11:02 GMT
Ah, very good point Darkstar...what would have happened if Ray had taken Jim's vote ?! I believe John would have still fought the good fight to prevent that from happening. Maybe not right away but eventually.
It's interesting that Pam is often refered to as Jim's wife. I do believe that first started at the request of her parents when Pam returned from Paris (was she interviewed by anyone at that time ? Did the press meet her at the airport or was there an official press conference ?). Either they were embarassed that she had been living in sin or they were shrewd right from the start regarding her rights to Jim's money and royalties.
I often wonder why Jim left 'everything' to her. Why not split it 3 ways between Pam and his siblings? Perhaps he didn't want Al Graham to get his hands on anything....nor his parents.
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Post by darkstar3 on Apr 11, 2011 18:33:04 GMT
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Post by kristyob on Apr 11, 2011 22:05:46 GMT
Hmm, interesting to read these documents Darkstar. Thanks for posting! I've seen the will many times but never noticed Paul Ferrara signed as a witness. Didn't she sign her testimony regarding his death P. Courson ?
If she really went by Pam Morrison and didn't want the fans to know they were married then it would explain why she was listed as Pamela Roselily for the Themis picture spread in Show magazine.
Also interesting to note that Andy was living with Anne.
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Post by darkstar3 on Apr 12, 2011 13:45:52 GMT
Hmm, interesting to read these documents Darkstar. Thanks for posting! I've seen the will many times but never noticed Paul Ferrara signed as a witness. Didn't she sign her testimony regarding his death P. Courson ? If she really went by Pam Morrison and didn't want the fans to know they were married then it would explain why she was listed as Pamela Roselily for the Themis picture spread in Show magazine. Also interesting to note that Andy was living with Anne. It is my understanding that Pamela used the name Pamela Roselily during the photoshoot for her store, Themis. Yes, you are correct. A few of the typed police reports in Paris were signed P. Courson. The information on these police reports came from an interpretor, Alain Ronay on behalf of Pamela because she couldn't speak French. Regarding Andy and Anne living together the address given on the probate documents have them living with their parents in Coronado California. I do not know why they are both listed as living with their parents at the time of Jim's death but that is the address that is given on the documents. I can only speculate that by having one address it would certainly cut down on the certified mail in regards to the probate instead having the mail go to different addresses. I will start a new thread that lists the information I have regarding Jim's death as this thread is for discussion of the probate of his will and claims filed against his estate.newdoorstalk.proboards.com/index.cgi?action=display&board=grave&thread=1659&page=1I will start by posting the Death Of American Citizen Documents and if fans are interested I have many, many book and article notes in regards to this period in time. |
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Post by kristyob on Apr 12, 2011 19:27:11 GMT
Thanks Darkstar, definitely interested : ) and you are right...one address seems to make sense in regards to notices.
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Post by TheWallsScreamedPoetry on Jun 16, 2011 11:02:36 GMT
With the latest very disturbing news regarding the Lezard King Bar in Paris it seems as if these people are addicted to litigation. They sued each other, Jim, Pam, Wolfgangs vault, some nightclub, they hounded Doors fan sites off the internet, clamped down on DCM's trading activities and now are bothering a Paris bar owner who is giving them the best free advert in Paris. Their legal team must love working for these morons as there is always another sucker waiting in line to be sued with these people. These are things that get brushed under the carpet in The Doors world but these guys are one bunch of greedy people. Check out the 2003 trial threads for more info on the way these people go on. Earthquake in LA....Rock n Roll On Trial, The Doors trial 2003-2008
Also check out the question of whether The Doors have any responsibility to Jim Morrison's grave considering how often they use the guy to make money. When The Music's Over .........
I was standing next to Jim Morrison's grave when suddenly.....
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gizmo
Door Half Open
Posts: 113
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Post by gizmo on Jun 19, 2011 14:21:38 GMT
i'm still surprised that they didn't went to court to get some money for what jim could have made for them coz he died to early. poland said in the european union that they wanted more money coz of the 2nd world war, if the second world war didn't take so much polish lives it would have had the sama amount of ppl as germany and therefore are missing taxincome on them. so that can be the next court appereance for the doors?
caterpillar (ray) never-enough
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